"Dedicated To The Winners & The Losers..." - Raekwon

Friday, June 5, 2009

No Words...Further Proof Lil Wayne Is Overrated Edition

It totally would make sense that Dwayne Carter would be make a song in tribute to the most overrated player of his generation.* And yes, I realize that Lakers are about to sweep the Magic in four games (and at most, five games) but we already knew that.** This is the type of karmic symmetry that you can't make up. The two most overrated figures of their generation on one song of over hyped mediocrity. Brilliant.

* I base this conclusion, on the fact, that he's spent the better part of the decade being hailed as the second coming of Jordan and the best player alive and I just don't think that's EVER been true. I've always felt that Shaq and Tim Duncan were clearly better throughout the majority of his career (more dominant at their positions, more consistently great teams, better teammates etc.) but got inexplicably written off from best player discussions because they were centers (or faux-power forward in Duncan's case). And if anybody is still thinking that he's better than Kobe needs to consider what Lebron did last series even if the Cavaliers lost. Tou switch Lebron with Kobe and the Lakers might not lose a game... the whole season.

** While what the Magic were clearly a better than my Cavaliers last round, their
dominance against them was. They shot damn near 50% from three point range, shot more free-throws than the Cavs (seriously, whiny Magic fans look it up), and had six of the seven best players (Howard, Lewis, Turkogulu, Pietrus, Skip To My Lou, and Courtney Lee) in the series and STILL the Magic were two defensive stops (Rashard's last second shots in Game 1 and Game 4) from losing that series, 4-1. They played perfectly and still might have lost to the Cavs who outside of Lebron played as abysmally as you can possibly play basketball without being WNBA players. The huge defensive mismatches that the Magic presented the Cavs will be negated by the size of the Lakers backcourt and the presence of Gasol, Bynum and Odom in their front court. The conference finals proved the Cavaliers were pretenders not that the Magic were contenders. The only way the Lakers lose this series is if Shane Battier and Ron Artest suit up for the Magic and the Lakers quit on themselves. Its seriously killing me that the least-deserving team in the playoffs (outside of Detroit) is going to win the NBA Finals relatively handily.

Excuse me while I throw up.


yeaaaaaaaaaaaaa said...

One thing I would like to touch on, how does "Tim Duncan had better teammates" mean he was a better player? Kind of irrelevant no? lol

Also Kobe was almost definately the best player in the world the year Nash won his first MVP. Almost 36 PPG? And he carried a terrible Lakers team to I think 47 wins in a tough conference.

Your Kobe hate shines through brightly.

Also, how exaclty are the Lakers undeserving except for the fact that Kobe plays for them? lol

DocZeus said...

The Lakers played with a massive sense of entitlement the first two rounds and almost collapsed against a Houston Rockets team when they were missing their two best players when they shouldn't have a lost a game to them when they were (relatively) healthy.

And about the 36 point season that Lakers fan like to point to, nobody remembers this but Lebron James had an equally if not more impressive season that year as well. He averaged 31.4 points per game, 7 rebounds and 7 assists per game as well and the Cavs ended up winning 50 games this season (3 more games than the Lakers.) And if you thought the Cavs supporting cast was bad this year, that was a team that had the corpse of Eric Snow starting at point guard, and Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden, Donyell Marshall and Damon Jones prominently involved. We had even less talent than the Lakers (at least, the Lakers had Odom) and were one defensive rebound from beating Detroit and going to the Eastern Conference finals.

Lebron was as good or better than Kobe that year. In fact, he finished second in MVP voting. Although, we can both agree that Nash getting was total bullshit.

DocZeus said...

Here is a list of the most deserving players/teams of championship based on playoff performance, constituency and actually giving a crap:

1a. Lebron James (The rest of the Cavs are dead to me right now)
1b. Orlando Magic
3a. Boston Celtics
3b. Denver Nuggets.
3c. Houston Rockets
6. Chicago Bulls
7. Dallas Mavericks
8. San Antonio Spurs
9. Dwayne Wade
10. Atlanta Hawks
11. Utah Jazz
12. Portland Trailblazers
13. Philadelphia 76ers
14. New Orleans Hornets
15. Los Angeles Lakers (The best team in the league but plays way too often like a team that doesn't give a shit. Thats unforgivable)
16. Phoenix Suns

32. Detroit Pistons (Didn't deserve to be in the playoffs, wasted talent, loathable players, gave up on themselves)

Passion of the Weiss said...

I'm a die-hard Laker fan, and I'd rather hear Tony Parker than this driver. What a terrible song.

Passion of the Weiss said...


Jay Deff Kay said...

"The two most overrated figures of their generation on one song of over hyped mediocrity. Brilliant."

I don't mind the song. Its probably just alright but its this harmless throwaway track that Wayne just tossed out there. I don't see anybody overhyping this track.

And with all due respect, Kobe being overrated sounds like bitter talk. Lebron's obviously ridiculously amazing but I doubt anyone's been ignoring or dismissing this fact. I can understand if you feel slighted by Laker stans and are trying to bring them down a peg but at the end of day Kobe's still among the top 5 players in the league. Its painfully obvious and there's nothing overrated about that. Make all the hypotheticals you want, but the fact remains that he's taken this team to the finals the second year in a row. Lebron sadly hasn't. Define overrated.

I'm still rooting for the Magic though. Those big bodies on the Lakers defense are a problem but as a team, the Magic have way more options than the Lakers.

Obvious point: Stan Van Gundy = Super Mario. And as we all know, Mario is pretty much a crackfiend for those rings.

Also, if we're gonna stretch this lookalike theme, Phil Jackson might be Luigi, and so this Super Mario bros clash will not be pretty.

DocZeus said...

Well yeah, clearly, he's one of the five best players in the league and will continue to be until he either gets hurt or retires. I just think his significance historically is overrated. Would we even be having this conversation if he wasn't able to force that trade and play for the Hornets? Like if we switched Kobe for T-Mac, VC or Iverson early in their careers, wouldn't the Lakers have still won those championships?

I suppose it will all be irrelevant in about a week because Kobe is going to win the big one on his own so it won't really matter.

bding7 said...

"Like if we switched Kobe for T-Mac, VC or Iverson early in their careers, wouldn't the Lakers have still won those championships?"

absolutely not. VC has no personal drive anymore (and he's never had any defense); T-Mac is selfish and gets hurt all the time; and AI wouldn't work in Phil Jackson's system. he's a force that has to be let loose by his coach, not a piece in the triangle.

I'm rooting for the Magic, too. spread the success around, I always say.

tray said...

Uh, Kobe clearly >>> T-Mac, VC, AI. He's by far the best of that generation of next Jordan contenders. That said, sure, Duncan was a better player in his prime. But being the best non-big man in the league counts for something.

tray said...

Or rather, having once been the best, as LeBron, I agree, has surpassed him.

Kai said...

"Like if we switched Kobe for T-Mac, VC or Iverson early in their careers, wouldn't the Lakers have still won those championships?"

Ive made this point before, but that has more to do with Shaq's dominance at that time, than any shortcoming of Kobe. THe year you referred to where Lebron won 3 more games than Kobe is a joke. The eastern conference was a joke at that time, what KObe did out west was more noteworthy.

Kobe is the better player, he has more of a killer instinct. Lebron is amazing though, no on can doubt that. Kobe will win a ring this year, and this is his 2nd trip to the finals.

Sir, u are a hater. But its ok, I'm a Knick fan, my pain is greater.

Trey Stone said...

stop the h8


Badmon3333 said...

I would have to say that Robert Horry is probably the most overrated player of all time. This motherfucker sinks one great shot per series and all of a sudden he's the most valuable sixth man of all time (word to Detlef Schrempf).

I definitely hate me some Kobe Bryant, but I wouldn't call him overrated. Kobe helps to put the Lakers in a position where they can have post-season success just about every year. Consistent quality. If anything, his surrounding cast is overrated. For some reason, Kobe's vapors seem to make ESPN think that the rest of the Lakers are great, too, and that's just not the case when you got Lamar Odom drooling over Sour Patch Kids and Derek Fisher trying desperately to be the next Robert Horry.

DocZeus said...

Vince Carter, AI, and T-Mac all got their reputations as losers because of the way their career arcs went. They played as essentially one man shows on teams with incompetent GMs that couldn't build around them. Did any of them play with anybody nearly as dominant as Shaquille O'Neal during their primes? I guess you might be able to argue that McGrady had Yao but even then it's Yao Ming, a guy who could break his foot jogging on a treadmill... repeatedly.

My point is that while Kobe was an integral part of the Lakers success, he was totally replaceable figure on those Lakers team with any number of superstar swing men. Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, McGrady, Carter or T-Mac would have all produced similar results had they had the fortune of playing with Shaq. You're kidding youself or simply not remembering how great they were 10 years ago. And if that happened, their would be no stigma attached to their name. Would McGrady have never gotten out of their first round if he played with Shaq. Of course not.

Now Kobe is most definitely better than all of those players. He's remarkably remained at a dominant level for much longer than any of those guys did which is a testament to the amazingness of his game. I just don't think you can definitely argue that he's been the best player in the league at any given time which is why I say he's overrated (which maybe a tad bit harsh. He's consistently been the second or third best player in the league for 10 years now). Personally, I think Duncan, Shaq and Lebron have all been better than him at any given time throughout his prime.

DocZeus said...

Plus, there's absolutely no way that Kobe Bryant doesn't get the team cancer label tossed on him if he spent his career toiling on the Charlotte Hornets. I mean the man murdered the 2004 Lakers to the point that Phil Jackson quit the team rather than deal with his shenanigans anymore. You think he wouldn't pull a Vince Carter if he was playing on a mid-market team. I mean, hell, two years ago, he was demanding a trade to Chicago because he didn't want to play with Andrew Bynum. Kobe is far from the model teammate.

tray said...

Yes, but for a considerable period of time he was the best perimeter player in the league, and for an even longer period of time he's been the second best player in the league. I don't see your point about VC, AI and T-Mac because you admit that Kobe's better. VC or T-Mac might've won one championship with Shaq, but not all 3. Many of those Western Conference Finals were close - the series with Sacramento, the series with Portland. Hard as it is to fathom, they needed both Shaq and Kobe to win (partly because those teams didn't play very good defense).

MCH said...


Sorry but its the truth. Lebron is like Peyton Manning...great in the regular season but chokes in the playoffs (aside from the one superbowl, and I am a Colts fan by the way).

Saying that if you switched Lebron with Kobe, the Lakers would go undefeated is just foolish.

DocZeus said...

I don't know how you can say that Lebron "chokes" in the playoffs. The man just averaged nearly 40 points per game, 10 rebounds and seven assists in a conference finals. He did just about everything humanely possible that is possible to win a playoff series but defend Dwight Howard (which might not have been the worst idea of the series) and coach the team and after Mike Brown imploded and reverted back to his 2005 version that wouldn't have been the worst idea, either. The rest of the team just let him down immensely. The team just collapsed around him. (Although, I have a sneaking suspicion that wouldn't have happened if the Cavs weren't from Cleveland.)

I'm sorry if you replace Kobe with Lebron in that series, the Cavs get swept by an average of 20 points. Kobe quits on the team after Game 2 and mails in his performance the rest of the time.

What I always try to impress on Kobe fans that the difference between Kobe and Lebron isn't any of their on-the-court skills. I mean you can make the argument that Kobe's a better shooter or Lebron's a better passer to the blue in your face. I think that's a bit of a wash. The difference is the psychological component of the game. Kobe is such a psychotic competitor and obsessed with his own image and place in the history of the game that his brilliance can be a detriment to the players around him. His lack of true leadership is his Achilles Heels. That's why the Lakers despite their immense talent always seem on the verge of self-destruction. They aren't willing to follow Kobe to the depths of hell. He could never last on a team that isn't built to his liking. That's why he couldn't last with Shaq and demanded to be traded on numerous occasions. He's not built for adversity.

On the other hand, Lebron radiates so much natural confidence and charisma that it rubs off on his team. They WANT to play their best for him. You get the feeling that his teammates would die for him if they asked. Every year, the Cavs have had Lebron, the team has overachieved beyond expectations. Every time they've lost in the playoffs, its because they ran into a team that was simply just better than them. They don't lose to teams that aren't supposed to and sometimes they beat them anyway.

Choking in the playoffs. Nah. Never that. He's just run into the breaking point where his talent can't overcome his team's shortcomings.

tray said...

Certainly played a great series. I did think, though, that the fourth quarter in Game 6 was a missed opportunity. Orlando was missing all of their shots; as much as Cleveland was down, had they just scored 34 in the quarter they would've won the game. LeBron barely scored in the period. I guess you can say that he'd had it if you want, but still.

Ross said...

Kobe 4, LeBron 0...til this changes, Kobe is better. The Lakers would have won 0 of these titles without Kobe. The Kings would have been the team of the early 2000s if Kobe was elsewhere. Til LeBron reaches a level at the FT line in which he doesn't miss, Kobe is better. Fans love LeBron's freakish abilities. That is what people enjoy watching in today's athletes. However, Kobe is exponentially more intelligent on the court than LeBron. He has no weaknesses, which cannot be said for LeBron.